Re: County Cricket Thread 2010

[beamer]

I can't see Colly being a candidate for the Test job, he's older than Strauss for one thing and also he's generally been a reluctant captain. Assuming Strauss goes on another couple of years, they're not going to appoint a 36-year-old unless there's really nobody else - I know Gooch took the job at that sort of age, found the best form of his career and went on into his 40s but that's extremely rare.

It is about who's in the right place at the right time though - when the captaincy becomes available then it's a question of who is in form with the bat and sure of their place, which changes from one series to the next never mind over a few years.

It will be between Cook, or, wait for it, Andrew Gale, who they have identified as a FEC before he's even played a test. He'll more than likely be leading the Lions this winter, and they'll be looking sooner or later to squeeze him into the side at the expense of Collingwood.

Nearly 27, uncapped in any international format and with a mediocre FC record - that's a long way from the England captaincy as far as I can tell. Still I suppose anyone who gets a chance and becomes a fixture in the side, batsmen at least, will be in with a shout of becoming captain.

[Allan D]

It will be between Cook, or, wait for it, Andrew Gale, who they have identified as a FEC before he's even played a test. He'll more than likely be leading the Lions this winter, and they'll be looking sooner or later to squeeze him into the side at the expense of Collingwood.

Maybe Mark Pettini might make a comeback too! Seriously though, you may have a point. England also has a history even since the abolition of amateur status of identifying players on their potential captaincy abilities and then letting them wait before they get into the side at the top or near it - Tony Lewis, whose only experience of Test cricket had been as 12th man against the Windies in the final Test at The Oval in 1966, came straight in as captain for the 1972-3 tour of India and Pakistan when Illingworth declined to tour, Mike Denness, whose Test experience was limited to 2 Tests against New Zealand in 1969 went as Lewis' vc and succeeded Illingworth at the end of 1973 despite not playing in any Tests that summer, Brearley had gone at the age of 22 as a reserve wicketkeeper on the last England tour of apartheid South Africa in 1964-5 and then had to wait 12 years before playing in 2 Tests against the Windies and then going as Greig's vc on the tour of India and Australia in 1976-77, succeeding him the following summer after the Packer crisis emerged.

Even Strauss was on the fringes of the England side for some time, captaining the 'A' side I think, before he was given a chance at Test level at the rather belated (even for England) age of 27 thanks to Vaughan twisting his knee in the nets. Within two years Strauss was captain. Some FECs fall by the wayside and end up commentating on Tests rather than playing in them. Mark Nicholas immediately springs to mind.

However in the era of central contracts I think it is less likely that a player will be brought in from outside the contracted players to captain the side as the selectors would fear the risk of the captain not being able tojustify his place in the side. I think this is why Collingwood was chosen to captain the T20 side despite having little or no experience at county level rather than an outsider with a record of success in the format, such as Key, being brought in.

This of course has its drawbacks. In the old days when England was merely a representative side drawn from county players the England captain more often than not captained a county side and was able to hone his skills outside the international arena. Brearley had 6 seasons as Middlesex captain from 1971-6 before being appointed to the England role (and of course continued to lead Middlesex for another 6 seasons until the end of the 1982 season). Characteristically, he put himself through a six-year degree course in captaincy, ruthlessly interrogating experienced players such as Illingworth and Close as to their captaincy choices in post-match tutorials. They were more than happy to cooperate as they realised that they were dealing with a probable FEC.

Unfortunately that kind of preparation is no longer possible and an international captain, especially in the limited-overs formats, is subject to the "sink or swim" discipline of on-the-job training. Although it is true that players like Atherton and Vaughan made reasonable captains without ever captaining their respective county sides a player like Cook would benefit immensely from captaining Essex on a full-time basis for a couple of seasons, a possibility currently denied to him by central contracts. Captaincy is just as much a skill of the game as batting, bowling or fielding and to be perfected requires constant exercise and practice.

[Merlin]

I cannot honestly see either Cook or Bell succeeding Strauss as captain - and strongly hope they don't.

Neither appear to have the serious "balls in the mangle" fighting spirit nor any "nous in the skull" attributes - (getting one bowling switch (Tahir) correct in a 40-Over smash 'n' grab does not count towards the requisite "tactical skills" AD) - and frankly, IMO both are confirmed sheep., ie., followers rather than leaders - who (a) will get rattled when targeted by the oppos and (b) rarely perform solidly when the chips are down. And let's not start pointing to the rarefied 2 or 3 knocks from Bell where he has battled against the odds .... without first taking into account the other 40 + where he has not.
Cook is far too flimsy ... has batting technique problems have been exposed, yet not altered or adjusted... and he comes across as a nice chav who wants to please - rather than an arse-kicking Chelmsford gang leader who should be respected!!

So who then?

Strange as it may sound right now, I'd go for Swann. Always in the mix, does his job well, has the necessary fighting spirit, never gets fazed, deals well with the media and clearly has the respect of his fellow players - oppos as well. He, IMO, is leadership material ... and it's time we had a bowler instead of a batsman at the helm.

... but, as long as the Gashed Piles resides in the throne room of Dusty's Selectors, Bell, sadly, has to be the favourite son. I reckon Tinker's been groomed from day one by the Gash to take over as captain .... you just watch it happen.

At which point I fear, England cricket will revert back to the bad old days of the 80's

[Allan D]

I agree that Swann would be a good choice as captain and may yet emerge through a combination of circumstances as Ray Illingworth did in 1969. However Cook is still in pole position as regards the Test captaincy with Bell coming up on the rails because of his new-found proficiency as a one-day player (and captain).

Nevertheless the issue remains academic as Strauss remains injury-free and in good form and is liable to go on for at least 3 or 4 more years. Collingwood also shows little signs of wear and tear and has led England to their first international trophy. Everything rests on what happens this winter.

[Henry]

Cook could develop into a good captain. I disagree with Merlin. I think Cook is pretty strong mentally. His ton at the oval reeked of character. He might lack tactical nous, but so does Strauss imo, even to this day. Cook will learn and get better and be better prepared in 2-3 years to take over from Strauss.

[JKLever]

If he has another shat tour of Australia, then he wont even get picked in the side for much longer let alone as Kapitan

[skully]

So, who won?

[JKLever]

Owais Shah joins Essex from Middlesex, Essex are also supposed to wrap up a new contract for Ravi Bop when he returns from SA and Danish Kaneria won't be rejoining as Essex want to go in another direction*

(*probably means no overseas player since we just splurged all our cash on Shah)

Once again we'll have a batting line up which is far too strong for Div 2, and a bunch of medium paced piemen for bowlers.

[Basil]

Owais Shah joins Essex from Middlesex, Essex are also supposed to wrap up a new contract for Ravi Bop when he returns from SA and Danish Kaneria won't be rejoining as Essex want to go in another direction*

(*probably means no overseas player since we just splurged all our cash on Shah)

Once again we'll have a batting line up which is far too strong for Div 2, and a bunch of medium paced piemen for bowlers.

Reminds me of a certain other side!

[DJ_Smerk]

James Harris is certainly not medium pace.